Hi are the grp hulls or the half grp/wood hulls any heavier than all wood hulls please.
the answer depends a bit on the type of GRP hull. Let me try and explain
Older (i.e. 1980s - 1990s) GRP hulls were made from chopped strand mat. The two makes I know of are the Holt Mirrors (see https://www.ukmirrorsailing.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=1937:holt-grp-mirror-dinghy&catid=180&Itemid=202) & Bell Ferranti Mirrors (see https://www.ukmirrorsailing.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=485:bell-woodworkingferranti-grp-mirror-dinghy&catid=180&Itemid=202). These were also availabe in a composite (GRP hull, wood decks) version (from Holt and Bell/Widebeam, see https://www.ukmirrorsailing.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=574&Itemid=1056). These boats were heavier than carefully built wooden boats (one recorded at 85Kg, by comparison, the minimum hull weight of a Mirror is 45.5Kg). They were also not very stiff (so panels would bend when you sailed in a chop/waves and if you tried to have tight standing rigging (shrouds & forestay), the hull would just bend. These two problems meant they were no good for racing, and, as a result, they just tended to be purchased by cruising sailors or Scout groups etc. where low maintenance was an overriding factor.
It was not until Jonny Collova (AKA "The angry ant") of Vasco Boats, a boatbuilder from Australia, came up with a foam sandwich Mirror in 2000/2001 that things changed. Foam sandwich hulls are made from a thin layer of GRP (woven mat rather than chopped strand mat), then a quite thick (8mm, 10mm) layer of lightweight foam, then another thin layer of GRP (woven mat). It's a bit more challanging to make a foam sandwich hull, but the result is a far better boat. These foam sandwich boats were down to (minimum) weight and stiff. Please note, these boat are quite delicate, and can be subject to compression damage (e.g. if you put a hull on a sandy beach with a stone on it, a compression mark will be left on the hull), example here. This sort of damage is normally cosmetic than structural.
In 2002 TridentUK (who had taken over Bell/Widebeam when it went bust so had their moulds) started making a foam sandwich boat (see https://www.ukmirrorsailing.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=486:tridentuk-frp-mirror-dinghy&catid=180&Itemid=202) and these are still being made (now moulded by Ginger Boats with new moulds). In 2008 Winder Boats started making their "foam sandwich" Mirror which currently dominates the racing circuit in the UK.
The weight of a wooden boat is largely determined by the plywood used for the panels and, to a lesser extent, by the weight of the hardwood parts, in particular the aft transom doubler, the thwart and the outer gunwales. The care an attention during building also makes a difference. Early plywood (for example in 1969) was thin gaboon outer layers and a thick inner layer of (rather "carroty") mahogany. In the mid 1990s Bell/Widebeam were using Taal gaboon ply (three or five gaboon plys of equal thickness), generally regarded as the best ever.
So in summary, older GRP hulls are heavier than wood hulls (in general). Modern GRP foam sandwich (sometimes called FRP) boats are either right on minimum weight or not much over. Well built wooden racing hulls (Goodwin, Duffin, Platford, Sherwin,....) will also be right on minimum weight or not much over. Badly build wooden boats can be a fair bit heavier (55-60Kg)
70923, sailing as 70844, on charter to Howard Leoto & Lisa Madlewa from South Africa, she finished 5th at the 2023 Mirror Worlds in Sligo.
One of the UK Mirror Class Association Demonstration boats, 70923 is now available to any sailing club wanting to borrow a Mirror for the 2025 season. Ideal for a club looking to build their Mirror fleet by showing their club members what a modern Mirror looks like and how they sail. 70923 is a fully equipped Winder with Bermuda mast and spinnaker, boom up cover and comes on a double stacker Winder combination road trailer and trolley.
[Editors note - I am not an expert on this subject, so please let me know if any of the following is incorrect.]
According to the Düsseldorf Boat Show organisers,
"...used boats and yachts built before 16 June 1998 and already put into service within the EU do not require a CE mark." So this would apply to any Mirror with a sail number below around 69915 according to our list of sail numbers against year of manufacture.
For newer boats, and the situation regarding importing older boats into the EU, read on:
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GRP & GRP composite boats built by Widebeam Ltd., such as 69992 'Swan Lake' have a plasic builders plaque with some CE conformity information on it. Details are as follows:
| Parameter | Value |
| Design Category | C |
| Maximum Crew | 4 |
| Maximum load | 350Kg |
| EU Notified Body | No. 0808 (Irish Sailing Association) |
Widebeam was formed when Bell Woodworking went out of business in 1999. It's likely Bell Woodworking would had taken the same approach on boats they built after 16th June 1998.
GRP foam sandwich boats sold by Trident-UK (at least while we were in the EU) came with a EC Declaration Of Conformity to Directive 94_25_CE (same details as show above for Widebeam Ltd). These boats were introduced onto the market around 2002.
As far as I can work out, wooden boats built after 16th June 1998 (by professional builders like Duffin Marine, Trident-UK) or built by amateur builders, but then sold within 5 years of "entering service" would also need CE conformity. Kit manufacturers Trident-UK provided a EC Declaration of Conformity Statement with their kits stating the panels are to the approved design of a Mirror (and I would imagine they still do for kits sold into the EU). There are sections for professional and amateur builders to declare they have built the kit into a boat in accordance with the building instructions, so it will comply with the Directive. According to the Düsseldorf Boat Show organisers amateur built boats which are sold more than 5 years after they entered service do not need a Declaration Of Conformity.
GRP foam sandwich boats manufactured by Winder Boats are classed as '...solely for racing... ' under the EU regulations, and have (or had) a RYA sticker on them saying that (see above). So I presume that means some/all of the regulations (e.g. around stability) don't apply. These boats were introduced onto the market around 2008.
Note: I think Winder Boats have choosen to go down this route, rather than test their Mirror for compliance with the Directive, presumably because most Winders are used for racing and they have probably taken the same decision with other, less stable, classes they manufacture (e.g. Merlin Rocket class dinghies). All Mirrors have the same hull shape (within small tolerences) and are similar weight. We know the Mk 3 Interior GRP foam sandwich boat built by Alkar Technology in Belgium was tested and complied with the Directive. It's hard to imagine why a Winder would not pass if it was actually tested.
According to Cloe Evans, Boating Information Officer at the RYA (2024):
'There is still a requirement regarding vessels which were in the UK at the time of Brexit, the 31st Jan 2021. The EU have stated that if the CE marked vessel was in the UK at the time of Brexit and it is to be sold back into the EU, then there will be a requirement for a re-certification of the existing CE mark.
If the vessel is to be used in the EU then it can be used under the Temporary Importation allowance for a limted time without re-certification.
Vessels post 16th June 1998 are CE certified to show compliance to the requirements of the Recreational Craft Directive, this does not verify if a vessel is of a certain “class” or model outside of the fact that the manufacturer is giving it a name, such as “Mirror Dinghy”. The CE certification is demonstrated through the manufacturer completing a Declaration of Conformity document, a DoC, It may be that the International Mirror Class Association recognises the DoC as means of showing that the vessel is a Mirror Dinghy as the manufacturer has declared this on the certificate, but this is not validated. In addition the only organisations that can issue a CE mark or certification, aside from the manufacturer are EU notified bodies, and so the (UK Mirror Class or International Mirror Class) association would not be able to issue a CE certificate.'
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25 Mirror Dinghies entered the Southern Area Championships today. Beautiful sailing conditions and 4 races held. Jewels came 9th and I came 12th.
The event was won by current National Champions Ben & Keira McGrane in Elsa, Runners up were Chris & Adriana Balding in Yolo, with 3rd place going to Chris & Will Fuller in Ripples.
As I was the only Single Handed sailor I did pick up a prize for leading Single Handed sailor! ?. Jewels was leading female helm but there wasn't a prize for that! ?
